MK forum

Mom of "Courageous" and the other warriors in your family:

Thank you, sweet sister, for your support shown for us. We have been through a lot together, haven't we? Please know I love you in the Lord Jesus, and pray for your encouragement and strength in the battle. Hug each one of your "biddies" for me and the "great-biddies" too.

Survivor - I see it quite differently.
I see Cynthia Armour as a young woman who so desperately is hanging on to the wall she so meticulously has constructed around her ever so fragile world. She knows she is fragile and she knows that just a whisper of wind will blow her house down. She has some secret fears that there is more to this abuse but so badly needs to keep all her bricks together in order to remain standing;. She is actually a victim.

As a 14 year old she was not in a position to handle the heinous crimes her daddy committed against her cousins. Instead of being able to mature as a normal teenager she had to become the defender and the protector of her father. Reverse roles and not entered into without a severe price to her own sense of well being.

I not only wish justice for you and healing to your broken places but I also hope that she can have the help she needs when (not if) this all crumbles at her feet and she can let go. She has had to walk a tight line to keep her world together. As women approach their 30s it seems more and more deal with the hard issues of their lives.

Your integrity and tenacity for truth and justice may not only help you and other sexually abused victims of Steve’s, but you may be able to crack the wall of protection for your cousin. Thank you for your voice. You have our support!

I can't stop thinking of my cousins today, Steve's daughters. I want to say that I know what it's like to want to believe a lie. For 5 or 6 years I lived in denial of what had happened and was happening to me. I tried to think of every excuse possible for Steve's actions. Maybe I just imagined it? Maybe it was an accident? Maybe he didn't mean to? Maybe he meant to but didn't realize the hurt it would cause? Maybe it really happened to someone else, not me? It was too much for my young mind and heart to process. I did not want to believe that "my favorite uncle" was capable of this. I had always felt so loved, protected, and cared for by him. I felt valued by him. How could it be possible that he would do these things? There had to be some mistake.
It wasn't until I started imagining him doing the same things to my sister that I had to see the truth. Under no circumstances could this be excused.
It wasn't until my adult years that I started connecting all the dots. The older I get, the more I realize how truly bad and damaging the abuse was. When I got married and experienced intimacy the way God intended, it made me aware of a whole other level of how disgusting Steve's actions were. What he had stolen from me. Then when I had my own children and was blown away by there preciousness and purity, I was filled with even more anger realizing how much he had taken advantage of me. And that need to protect others just grew and grew.
So I understand the struggle of not wanting to accept the truth. I understand the hurt of betrayal and deceit.

Interested: True, very true. Because of Steve's sin there are many, many victims. Not only did he abuse his victims but he has deceived many, many people. The hurt is far reaching. The effects of his sin are great. Generations have been affected.

Being that I know the Armours very well along with at least one of the girls Steve abused, I thought I would give some of my thoughts on the issue. I am torn...

First, I can totally identify with the anger and righteous wrath of the girls he abused and their families. If he had done that to my sister, I would have wanted to kill him (and who knows, I may have tried). I would probably still hate him to this day, and I doubt I could ever forgive him. Even if I were to ever forgive him, there would need to be more consequences for him than a tarnished reputation. I would have done the same thing victim #1 did in regards to telling his son-in-laws to beware. However, his despicable acts have not affected me directly, so as much as I know how horrific his abuse was, I cannot claim to have any idea of what his victims and their families have gone through. So, if I say something errant while attempting to understand the Armours' side of things, forgive me, because I am completely ignorant in regards to the emotional trauma of being personally affected by sexual abuse.

I know Cynthia and Arlen Isaak. If you do not know them, it would be easy to disregard the letter Cynthia wrote as a naive girl trying to brush over her father's sins as a minor ordeal. However, Cynthia and Arlen are two of the most genuine individuals I have ever had the pleasure of spending time with. When Cynthia wrote in the letter that she spent countless hours crying for her father's abused victims, I would bet my life on it that she literally spent countless hours crying. I think she took too much flack for her letter on this forum. It would be hard to write a letter that honest when it involved the sexual sins of your very own father. Is she biased? Of course, but she wrote openly and honestly about how these acts affected her. She wrote about the atrocity of sin and the victory through the cross. I wouldn't fault her motives if you don't agree with her conclusions.

Also, please do not discredit the Light in Action ministry because of Steve's sins. Lives are being changed through the people on this team. I have never been very close to Steve, but I have seen the love the members of this ministry have for the hurting and the lost. They are not a stagnant ministry. They are constantly on the move, reaching out to the community, and people are drawn to them and the message of Christ they proclaim. This was a rabbit trail, but having seen the ministry firsthand, I wanted to share how I was challenged by the members of this team and saw Christ in their lives.

But here's the thing...as much as I love the Armour family, the members of Light in Action, and their ministry, the people affected by Steve's sin need more than an apology. If he said "Sorry" 100 times a day to each of these girls, it would not take away the years of shame, fear, and emotional trauma they experienced. Knowing that he's "walking in victory" now doesn't make things all better for his victims. His acts were criminal, and his consequences weren't harsh enough. If he had done this in America, he would have gone to jail. If he had abused my sister and never gotten more than a slap on the wrist for it, I'd be infuriated to this day.

Now, for just a second, put yourself in Steve's shoes. What should he do? Has he done all he can do? He has come clean and admitted everything. Obviously he wasn't punished sufficiently, but should he seek to get himself punished sufficiently? I really do believe that he hasn't done anything sexually inappropriate since '92, and I do believe that he is being held accountable and trusting God for victory over his sexual sins. I'm just rambling here, but I really think Steve wants to serve God with his life. He did what he could, dealt with the consequences, and now he's trying to put his dirty past behind him and serve the Lord the best he knows how. We all hate what Steve did and many of us are skeptical about his ministry and dubious of his future interaction with children, but what should he do now? What more can he do to make up for his abuse? If he or his family is reading this, I'm sure they want to do whatever they can. Should someone with his past never get involved in ministry again?

@thenumber7

You asked -
Should someone with his past never get involved in ministry again?

The answer is YES, he should never get involved in ministry again if by ministry you mean "full-time" ministry. Should he be allowed to serve the Lord? Sure, but that might mean cleaning the toilets in the church. I'm not saying this meaning that he should be punished by cleaning toilets, but the reality is that ALL of us are to minister, to SERVE one another, and cleaning toilets is one way we can serve.

verb min·is·tered, min·is·ter·ing, min·is·ters
verb, intransitive
1. To attend to the wants and needs of others: Volunteers ministered to the homeless after the flood.

Toilets need cleaning. The floors need vacuuming. Someone needs to make sure the bills get paid. Someone needs to wipe the snotty noses of the little ones. Someone needs to teach the Scriptures. There are multiple ministries. His sin doesn't exclude him from the body of Christ. Good thing, or we are all goners. Each of us has a ministry, whether toilet cleaning or preaching, or perhaps even both.

We, the American Evangelical, fundamental, whatever it is we are, have had it wrong for a long time. There aren't different classes of Christians with missionaries and pastors and any in "full-time" ministry standing on a higher pedestal. We are all on level ground.

God forgives but consequences remain. I am firmly convinced that some sins require removal from positions of authority, particularly public positions. God thought so. Moses wasn't allowed to enter the promised land. It is a travesty that we allow such things. I am thrilled that Larry Brown and others personally went to Georgia and Indiana to deliver those letters. THAT is more a witness for God than any sermon. The unsaved can look at sermons and think "same old, same old - Meaningless religion - just a bunch of hot air posturing importance." But, publicly humbling oneself before the world? Now, THAT is different.

And now in response to the first part of that same paragraph
Now, for just a second, put yourself in Steve's shoes. What should he do? Has he done all he can do? He has come clean and admitted everything. Obviously he wasn't punished sufficiently, but should he seek to get himself punished sufficiently? I really do believe that he hasn't done anything sexually inappropriate since '92, and I do believe that he is being held accountable and trusting God for victory over his sexual sins. I'm just rambling here, but I really think Steve wants to serve God with his life. He did what he could, dealt with the consequences, and now he's trying to put his dirty past behind him and serve the Lord the best he knows how. We all hate what Steve did and many of us are skeptical about his ministry and dubious of his future interaction with children, but what should he do now? What more can he do to make up for his abuse? If he or his family is reading this, I'm sure they want to do whatever they can.

This answer is NO. He has NOT done all he can do. I only know from what I have read here yet what I have read here indicates to me that he has done NOTHING that evidences true repentance. Zaccheus repented and wanted to pay back four times what he had taken. Has Steve even done the bare minimum and gone to those he offended and apologized to them? TRUE apology, not just mouthing words. Has he sought to do all that he can do to make restitution? Unlike Zaccheus, Steve cannot make full restitution let alone 4x, just as a murderer cannot return the murdered one to life. However, Steve could, and I think if truly repentant WOULD, forever seek to do what he could to restore. Now THAT would be serving the Lord. How about helping to pay for counseling for starters?

You say, He has come clean and admitted everything.
On really? How do you know this? Only Steve knows what is EVERYTHING.

I really do believe that he hasn't done anything sexually inappropriate since '92,
And when a person is discovered to be a serial killer the neighbors say..., "But he is such a nice man. He does all these wonderful things in the community. He this, he that." (I'm not saying Steve is a serial killer. I'm only using this as an illustration to show how we can be so well-deceived.)

and I do believe that he is being held accountable and trusting God for victory over his sexual sins. I'm just rambling here, but I really think Steve wants to serve God with his life. He did what he could, dealt with the consequences, and now he's trying to put his dirty past behind him and serve the Lord the best he knows how.

I'm sure you do believe that. However, I believe you are naive. That reminds me of something else you said.

I know Cynthia and Arlen Isaak. If you do not know them, it would be easy to disregard the letter Cynthia wrote as a naive girl trying to brush over her father's sins as a minor ordeal. However, Cynthia and Arlen are two of the most genuine individuals I have ever had the pleasure of spending time with. When Cynthia wrote in the letter that she spent countless hours crying for her father's abused victims, I would bet my life on it that she literally spent countless hours crying. I think she took too much flack for her letter on this forum. It would be hard to write a letter that honest when it involved the sexual sins of your very own father. Is she biased? Of course, but she wrote openly and honestly about how these acts affected her. She wrote about the atrocity of sin and the victory through the cross. I wouldn't fault her motives if you don't agree with her conclusions.

We can be genuinely wrong.

There is nothing wrong with being naive except for being in danger because of not being as wise as serpents in the midst of the wolves.

I don't know her to have cause to think one way or the other. It is quite possible she has written openly and honestly and genuinely cried and hurt. I don't think the majority of "flack" has questioned that. (We can gag at what was said without gagging at the person who said it.) Many of us know what it is to be gentle doves and deceived. I think most of us believe that she too is deceived. She is living in denial as have we. That is why Survivor keeps thinking about them. They are her cousins who she has loved and Survivor knows about the wave of aching and seemingly unbearable pain that comes when we leave our cave of denial.

MK sheri, two thumbs up!

MK Sheri,
I could not have said it any better myself. Every point was so true.
* I will say what turns me off the most is when Christians start in on the position that the end justifies the means. When God gave us the great commission He said to go into all the world to light it up, not win Him as many souls as possible no matter the cost.