MK forum

Raz & Mosq Bite - I "Like" and I'm convicted! I was reading about "impression management" in the book "The Life You've Always Wanted" also - good stuff to consider.

To clarify, when I use the term fundamentalist I am talking about religious groups that adhere to a specific set of beliefs codified by American evangelicals in a set of 90 essays published from 1910 to 1915 by Biola. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fundamentals

I believed for many years that "fundamentalism" meant a belief that the Bible is fundamentally true, or that certain broad Christian beliefs were true (like the Apostles Creed). I kept running into conflict with my inlaws at the oddest (it seemed to me) times, because I thought we meant the same things by the same words. 'Twas not the case.

Like all words, without a baseline definition, we can't communicate clearly on the subject.

I think it's funny how the opposite of fundamenalist is presumed liberal. I think the opposite of fundamentalist is authentic, as in as close as one can get to the beliefs and practices of the pre-Constantine church. Liberal has the connotation of being not thoughtful, respectful, sincere, Bible believing or truly connected to the Lord Jesus Christ.

At least that's certainly what I got out of the word "liberal" all those years I was involved in fundamentalist churches. It was no term of respect, that's for sure!

Yeah, I remember thinking liberal was a swear word. And it was always said with a neo- word, which I thought was an enemy named Neil.

Thanks for the clarification, Allbetter.
I understand what you mean now.
And I think "authentic" is the place we need to be!
I also think it was interesting that Gene pointed out that labels are not always helpful.
Explanation helps alot. That is what good communication is all about----being allowed to ask questions and getting honest answers.

OOPS!
I mean--Thanks, Shadowspring2.
I really WAS listening.

I originally posted this on the Media Alerts thread, but it fits here, too. In fact, it probably fits here better....

One important difference between any independent investigation and a trial in a court of law is that there is no penalty for lying to the private investigators. There are very serious penalties for lying under oath. I'm sure this has not escaped NTM's notice, and I'm sure that is one reason why they will do everything they can to settle Jane Doe 7's claim out of court.

Another important difference is that independent investigators have no mechanism whereby they can compel NTM to do anything. We've already seen how well NTM has implemented the recommendations that GRACE made. Pat Hendrix and Co. may do an excellent job, and may have many recommendations for NTM, but even with professional LEOs in their ranks, they cannot do anything if NTM decides to say, "Thank you for your efforts" and does nothing.

To that extent, any independent investigation is always going to depend a whole lot more on NTM's cooperation and honesty than a law suit would. In fact, law suits generally arise because at least one side doesn't trust the other. So, it isn't a matter of trusting GRACE or trusting Pat Hendrix and her teams. GRACE has earned our trust; Pat Hendrix certainly deserves a chance, and her work for the Presbyterians is to her credit. But, the final outcome all depends on how cooperative NTM is.

If you are a victim, and you do not trust NTM, you do have a choice.

I agree with much of what Gene said. However, I would not agree that most victims have a legitimate legal remedy that would compel much of anything (unfortunately), for reasons discussed elsewhere. Without legal remedy, they are left relying on the cooperation of NTM, and this board has been responsible for "compelling" and guiding the extent and scope of that cooperation. To the extent there may now be some internal NTM forces doing a little internal compelling as well, I welcome it (and certainly don't discourage it).

Having said that, I do not discourage victims from seeking legal remedy to the extent it can be found.

And, I do not discourage further inducement of additional cooperation to the extent needed.

You make a LOT of sense, Thai MK!

Very well stated, and I concur!